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- cross-posted to:
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It’s small, but here’s a real actionable item that you can do to help:
Put a gentle “Use Firefox” (or any other non-Chromium-based browser) message on your website. It doesn’t have to be in-your-face, just something small. I’ve taken my own advice and added it to my own website: https://geeklaunch.io/ (Only appears in Chromium-based browsers.)
We can slowly turn the tide, little by little.
Copy and paste:
<p> This site is designed for Firefox, a web browser that respects your privacy. </p>(I also posted this on the HN discussion.)
Your browser supports Web-DRM. Some features might not be available.
This website does not support browsers that support web-drm
Time to De-Google I guess. I will keep using Firefox and if or when I come across any website pulling this crap I won’t hesitate to blast them to eternity. I suggest everyone else do the same please.
Time was a decade ago… But better now than never.
With that kind of attitude, it’s a wonder no one listened to you a decade ago!
Lol. As soon as I heard someone upload their contacts to Google I thought “welp, I’m out.” And yeah, no one listened then either.
Still, we got diaspora working finally. May the force be with you.
What’s with the hostile attitude?
What’s wrong with having a hostile attitude?
I’m just going to stop using sites that implement this tech. Maybe I’ll even make a site and actually contribute to the web with all the free time I’ll have 😇
It’ll be next to impossible when those websites are your bank and Netflix etc.
Not using Netflix is very possible :) Even easier with the pricing they are up to lately.
(But I know you were just listing some examples)
not sure if you’re talking about sailing there, but my point against Netflix would be that there are definitely more things to do in life than sitting through hours of passive low effort entertainment. it’s very obvious but I guess people are slowly forgetting about that
even gaming is better. at least you’re exercising your brain and motor skills
the banking thing is something else though. but it’s the kind of thing that’s probably done for security anyway, so it’s not that bad and things like that definitely wouldn’t be profitable enough for all this effort Google and others are putting into it 😅
Honestly this won’t effect me a ton, though I wouldn’t be surprised if I have to boot up a windows virtual machine just to check my bank in a few years cause my bank doesn’t know what Linux is and doesn’t want go trust it. I’m mad about it but given slowly but surely I’ve been replacing everything with FOSS stuff. I just fear one day they will force you to use corpo approved software to use WiFi , or get cell service
De-google, anyone?
How do you “de-google” when most websites expect most browsers to use chromium and start requiring this to ensure
companies buying ad space get the best bang for their bucksecurity?Most websites? Haven’t come across one yet (I am using Firefox on all devices and don’t have any other browser installed) … Do you have any examples?
Yeah I don’t think this comment is accurate, the only website that gives you a subpar experience to incentivize you to use a Chromium-based browser that I’ve come across is, well, google.com on mobile.
Luckily you can download a plugin on Firefox to trick google.com to show you the Chromium experience, or you can just use something like startpage.
Firefox and ublock origin to start. Site requires Chromium? Buh bye now.
Good luck with that when the site is your bank, your doctor, or your government.
IE in the 2000’s called, it wants it’s dream back.
Between this, hobbling adblockers and performing enough monopolistic acts to warrant swift government action, I really see this more as Chrome dying than the web itself.
Breakup Alphabet. It’s the only way.
Microsoft, Facebook, and Amazon next
What is WEI?
Stands for Web Environment Integrity. Beyond that, I know nothing.
DRM in the web.
excuse my ignorance, what is DRM?
Digital Rights Management. Usually DRM agreements are imbedded in the terms and conditions no one reads when they install software. It usually gives the software vendor the right to monitor your use of the software in real time via the internet.
Within the context of Chrome and other Chromium based web browsers, this means that Google will be able to monitor your web browsing in a new way any time you’re using a browser based on Chrome/Chromium.
Within the context of Chrome and other Chromium based web browsers, this means that Google will be able to monitor your web browsing in a new way any time you’re using a browser based on Chrome/Chromium.
With only slight hyperbole, we can say that Google can do this monitoring already.
What’s worse, is now they can:
- Refuse you access to information by refusing to attest your environment.
- Restrict your browser, extensions, and operating system setup by refusing attestation.
- Potentially bring litigation against you for attempting to circumvent DRM (in the USA it’s illegal to bypass DRM).
- Leverage their ad network to require web site operators to use attestation if they wish to serve ads via Google. AKA force you to use Chrome to use big websites.
- Derank search results for sites that are not using attestation.
In my opinion, the least harmful part of this is the ability to monitor page access, because they can more or less do this for Chrome users anyway. What’s really harmful here is the potential to restrict access to and destroy practically the entirety of the internet.
Can you explain to someone not so tech savy what this means?
No more add blockers. No more accessibility tools. Only what google wants you to see.
And this will work for google products only of for chrome as a whole?
It depends on how Google wants to play this. If they require website operators to use WEI in order to serve ads from Google’s ad network (a real possibility), then suddenly 98.8% of websites that have advertising, and 49.5% of all websites would be unusable unless you’re using Chrome. It’s probably safe to assume they’d also apply this to their own products, which means YouTube, Gmail, Drive/Docs, all of which have large userbases. The spec allows denying attestation if they don’t like your browser, but also if they don’t like your OS. They could effectively disallow LineageOS and all Android derivatives, not just browser alternatives.
A fork like Vivaldi, Brave or Opera could opt not to implement these changes, but then some websites could become incompatible to them.
A fork like Vivaldi, Brave or Opera could opt not to implement these changes
It doesn’t quite work like that. They wouldn’t choose to not implement the change, because the change comes from upstream via Chromium. They would have to choose to remove the feature which, depending on how it’s integrated, could be just as much work as implementing it (or more, if Google wants to be difficult on purpose). Not implementing the change is zero effort; removing the upstream code is a lot of effort.
Shamelessly stolen from the HN thread:
Don’t just comment and complain, contact your antitrust authority today: US:
EU:
UK:
India:
Email template:
I would like to bring your attention to Google’s recent proposal to add a feature to its Chrome (Chromium family) of browsers called Web Environment Integrity. This provides a mechanism to reinforce Google’s already dominant browser market position by creating a technological control that can be used to nullify a user’s choice of browser, device and operating system. This technology also has the potential for abuse by preventing users from using browser extensions that can enhance security by blocking unwanted and potentially malicious content, as well as browser extensions that help vulnerable users with enhanced accessibility needs, such as color blindness and visual impairment. Google’s dominant, near-monopoly position in the browser market already harms me as a consumer by reducing browser choices and preventing a competitive market for developing new browsers. Allowing Google to include this feature will reduce my browser choices and consolidate the browser market even further, and it is incumbent on [INSERT AUTHORITY HERE] to take action against this abusive behavior.ELI5 Anyone?
DRM for the web.
Basically, if your browser modifies a web page in any way (such as by blocking ads, applying a theme, disabling javascript, whatever), the server would be able to detect this and deny access.
Google is pushing some bullshit that would allow websites to check if a client (you, your browser, your device) is on the okie-dokey list. If yes, you may enter e. g. Youtube, if not the you’re out. It’s like a bouncer for websites and of course Google would be that bouncer. So you might stand out in the rain if you are using one of the following:
-
VPN
-
Adblock
-
Non-Chromium browser like Firefox
-
Basically drop „don’t be evil“, split to Alphabet, wait a few years, be evil
You will use the web as google said or you won’t use it at all.
This video by Louis Rossman is a pretty good explainer https://yewtu.be/watch?v=0i0Ho-x7s_U
So this is a problem for all browsers based on Chromium right???
No, it is a problem for all browsers, present and future, period.
The point is that major websites, even government ones might decide to be only available on Chrome.
So much for internet freedom…
People saying de-google like google isn’t in the position Microsoft was in when they killed Netscape. It’s over y’all, once it’s in chromium it’s the standard, period. The open web is dead.
Edit: ok, be in denial then.
Google isn’t alone in the box. The different governments and states should be in the box with them. It’s not like people warned Google and other corps are a threat to competition and freedom.
We didn’t see anything coming as antitrust procedure.
